How does it feel to be an American?

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Postby Kenny » Thu Oct 12, 2017 7:03 pm

They have probably mutated sheep shagging into dancing with sheep
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Postby lockheed » Thu Oct 12, 2017 7:05 pm

my physics teacher in high school was a barrel-chested welshman who loved to hunt down and shoot the squirrels colonizing his attic.
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Postby Lucky » Thu Oct 12, 2017 7:07 pm

Damn we have so many cool slebs though!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Welsh_Americans

Lesley Nielsen, Jessica Alba, Obama, Hillary, Robin Williams, Quincy Jones, Jesse James, Chelsea Manning!

er.. Dick Cheney, Dubya, Robert E Lee!

plus a buncha other Presidents who I don't know much about
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Postby furrowed brow » Thu Oct 12, 2017 7:21 pm

bigcat wrote:Oh, I've been to many other places and lived in the UK twice. My experiences abroad have led me to believe the baseline standard of living here is a notch above the rest. First world plus. And even though we're racist AF we're one of the only countries not founded on ethnic nationalism, that's pretty cool.


so my, surely very stupid, question then is, are we actually doing something right by having more conservative economic policy than other nations of similar wealth
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Postby VHB » Thu Oct 12, 2017 7:27 pm

identikit wrote:so is that poll from some time back true for you,it went along the lines how New Yorkers don't see themselves as American first, New Yorkers second, but the other way around?
I found that funny since that is def. true for Berliners. I have no clue about Germany nor did I ever feel/identify as German in any way.


there are several layers to American Provincialism.
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Postby Lucky » Thu Oct 12, 2017 7:31 pm

furrowed brow wrote:
bigcat wrote:Oh, I've been to many other places and lived in the UK twice. My experiences abroad have led me to believe the baseline standard of living here is a notch above the rest. First world plus. And even though we're racist AF we're one of the only countries not founded on ethnic nationalism, that's pretty cool.


so my, surely very stupid, question then is, are we actually doing something right by having more conservative economic policy than other nations of similar wealth


that non-socialised healthcare must kick the US a few notches up the rank too huh
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Postby Kenny » Thu Oct 12, 2017 7:31 pm

bigcat wrote:Oh, I've been to many other places and lived in the UK twice. My experiences abroad have led me to believe the baseline standard of living here is a notch above the rest. First world plus. And even though we're racist AF we're one of the only countries not founded on ethnic nationalism, that's pretty cool.


Didn't they found America with slavery and the attempted genocide of Native Americans.....
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Postby bigcat » Thu Oct 12, 2017 7:51 pm

furrowed brow wrote:
bigcat wrote:Oh, I've been to many other places and lived in the UK twice. My experiences abroad have led me to believe the baseline standard of living here is a notch above the rest. First world plus. And even though we're racist AF we're one of the only countries not founded on ethnic nationalism, that's pretty cool.


so my, surely very stupid, question then is, are we actually doing something right by having more conservative economic policy than other nations of similar wealth


We have actually had a comparatively more liberal national economic policy than most European countries over the past 10 years.
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Postby furrowed brow » Thu Oct 12, 2017 7:58 pm

Guh!? Puh?!
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Postby bigcat » Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:01 pm

Austerity vs stimulus
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Postby portia » Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:06 pm

identikit wrote:so is that poll from some time back true for you,it went along the lines how New Yorkers don't see themselves as American first, New Yorkers second, but the other way around?
I found that funny since that is def. true for Berliners. I have no clue about Germany nor did I ever feel/identify as German in any way.



i dont think it's specific to new york. i think if you live & work in a global city, particularly in a place with a large international presence, that rubs off on you and you relate to that way more than anything else.

i think of myself as an international civil servant first, a new yorker second (and don't give me that transplant shit in a city that's 50% not from here, i've lived my entire adult life here - and a large part of the reason i feel like a new yorker is that i'm part of that large segment of the population and it's one of the things i like about this country when it's good), and dont really think of myself as "of the united states" outside of like the responsibilities i have to other people that live here - but i don't feel like my responsibilities to other us citizens are any greater than to those of any other country, i just have more leverage to do things here by voting, being good to my neighbors, etc
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Postby lockheed » Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:09 pm

pootis i've run in to two former co-workers at the UN in the last two weeks just walking down the street, kinda makes me still feel like i'm part of that club
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Postby portia » Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:11 pm

lockheed wrote:pootis i've run in to two former co-workers at the UN in the last two weeks just walking down the street, kinda makes me still feel like i'm part of that club



you always are
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Postby Guy Incognito » Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:12 pm

we are well past the autocentrism discussion but when i tell people i often walk 2 miles each way to work and sometimes when i'm feeling lazy take the (free!) bus they look at me like i have two heads. this is within the metro area of a mid sized city that doesn't have much sprawl and i'm usually talking to academics when it comes up. car culture is engrained in the way people think about distance and conceive of the world around them, even beyond all the good (awful) stuff badhat posted. henry ford doomed us all.
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Postby portia » Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:12 pm

manunderer wrote:
identikit wrote:so is that poll from some time back true for you,it went along the lines how New Yorkers don't see themselves as American first, New Yorkers second, but the other way around?
I found that funny since that is def. true for Berliners. I have no clue about Germany nor did I ever feel/identify as German in any way.


there's no way this is applicable post 911

admittedly not too familiar with ny but arent a lot of native ny citizens aggressively patriotic types



there are people that are, but i mean 36% of the city wasn't born in the united states

the fabric of new york isn't really native new yorkers the way it was even like 10 years ago as far as i can tell
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Postby Guy Incognito » Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:14 pm

petty i'm sorry for needlessly picking argument with you earlier
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Postby identikit » Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:15 pm

portia wrote:
i dont think it's specific to new york. i think if you live & work in a global city, particularly in a place with a large international presence, that rubs off on you and you relate to that way more than anything else.


yea good point really.
your work is special that way, too, come to think of it, the only thing I have identified with in my adult life really is "my industry" - no matter where it is. odd really, and probably one of the reasons why I completely fail to understand patriotic or nationalist sentiments, I just don't know them. the only times I think of myself as "belonging to country A and B" are when I vote and see my tax forms.
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Postby Ferrous Bueller » Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:20 pm

for me it's seeing squandered potential and self-sabotage everywhere I look and feeling very disheartened because of it
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Postby portia » Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:20 pm

yeah, i mean 75% of my office isnt from the US. And I don't identify with the work I do, nor am I committed to it - I identify with the place I work, and am committed to that. So I'm in a fairly unique situation.

I feel more at home in another cosmopolitan city like Tokyo or Paris than I do in, like, Connecticut.

I do feel the tugs of the places I came from, but if im abroad and someone asks where im from im going to say new york, not the united states
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Postby identikit » Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:25 pm

actually not true, I also feel as belonging to that nation after elections and during major fuck ups. collective shame and disgust, paired with rage and occasionally hate, followed by despair. that's feeling patriotic to me.
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Postby portia » Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:27 pm

identikit wrote:actually not true, I also feel as belonging to that nation after elections and during major fuck ups. collective shame and disgust, paired with rage and occasionally hate, followed by despair. that's feeling patriotic to me.


Yeah, it's not like I don't feel the shame - and the luck - of being from the US, it's more that i dont feel a special allegiance to it or the need to promote it over any other country
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Postby identikit » Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:33 pm

yea promoting countries is a special task for me. not much to promote. "oh I'm half half, both hitler halfs, austria and germany, and then I moved to the US. let me sing some praises" would be pretty hilarious. on the other hand nonstop shitting on all 3 while talking to coworkers from Gambia to Chile to Iran would be pretty damn odd, too. Case of "check your privilege before you open your mouth."
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Postby Ferrous Bueller » Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:34 pm

The Alps and pastries is a pretty good one-two
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Postby portia » Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:42 pm

i think one thing ive learned as ive fallen into this identity is that all countries are pretty bad
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Postby identikit » Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:43 pm

It's funny, the "dream nation" in my head was New Zealand for the longest time. then new zealanders informed me a bit of their hm how do I put it...racism issues?

then I thought woa Iceland, super progressive, what major shit do they have? And then an Icelander had a laughing fit while presented with the idea their country might just be great in terms of progressiveness. Their answer still haunts me because it hadn't occurred to me.
"yea truly progressive, the magic trick is to stay 99,9% white in the first place." They were not exactly a fan and dreaming about moving to NYC...
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Postby portia » Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:48 pm

yeah, discovering how racist scandinavians are ten years ago was my "whelp" moment
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Postby portia » Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:51 pm

a norwegian dude i know who had always been super progressive on everything (particularly palestine, women's rights) accidentally sent a text to a guy he had just interviewed with instead of his gf calling him the n word and he just didn't get why it was so bad besides like "making someone angry"
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Postby lockheed » Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:54 pm

portia wrote:
lockheed wrote:pootis i've run in to two former co-workers at the UN in the last two weeks just walking down the street, kinda makes me still feel like i'm part of that club



you always are


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Postby office plant » Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:54 pm

identikit wrote:It's funny, the "dream nation" in my head was New Zealand for the longest time. then new zealanders informed me a bit of their hm how do I put it...racism issues?

then I thought woa Iceland, super progressive, what major shit do they have? And then an Icelander had a laughing fit while presented with the idea their country might just be great in terms of progressiveness. Their answer still haunts me because it hadn't occurred to me.
"yea truly progressive, the magic trick is to stay 99,9% white in the first place." They were not exactly a fan and dreaming about moving to NYC...


NZ is getting better but a huge chunk of the white majority population is just creepingly, sneakily racist. There are maybe two cities big and diverse enough that it's hard to be racist in terms of like - not constantly being around masses of other white people (although as we know, this doesmt necessarily discourage people).

I went to high school in a tiny town that is one of the whitest in NZ and one time, went to the supermarket there with my flatmate from london who is a black muslim. When we came out he was visibly spooked, he was like "I've never been surrounded by so many white people before".
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Postby hoopdog » Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:58 pm

man i wanna work at the un
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