ISRAEL/PALESTINE: THE THREAD

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Postby Feech La Manna » Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:34 am

I am all for an AMERICA: STILL DICKS thread
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Postby Kenny » Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:36 am

I feel torn because like I said I'm not trying to be call out guy, because I've got plenty of issues (OF WHICH CAR MAGAZINE?!?!) but I don't get why a thread title change is bad/big ask

Even an America: Still Dicks would be different because it's a majority American board
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Postby Kenny » Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:37 am

a-10 warthog champion wrote:
mystery meat wrote:Israel is not homogeneous, that's why the white supremacist government bent on making it homogeneous by enforcing racist and apartheid policies is still dicks



yeah, someone needs to explain this to junebug


My irony/sarcasm detector is stumped on this one
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Postby a-10 warthog champion » Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:38 am

Im just saying, someone should tell junebug what the actual situation on the ground in Israel is. So first of all,
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Postby Kenny » Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:39 am

Ah, it's working again now, just had to hit it a few times
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Postby Cronos » Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:41 am

Je suis bibi Netanyahu
Tone sincere also I would never troll or purposefully be antagonistic or anything on something serious.

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Postby Ted Pikul » Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:48 am

what if thread was ISRAEL: STILL CIRCUMCISED DICKS
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Postby mystery meat » Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:51 am

#notallisraelis
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Postby Jimmy Firecracker » Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:56 am

mystery meat wrote:Israel is not homogeneous, that's why the white supremacist government bent on making it homogeneous by enforcing racist and apartheid policies is still dicks


white supremacist?
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Postby mystery meat » Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:59 am

Jimmy Firecracker wrote:
mystery meat wrote:Israel is not homogeneous, that's why the white supremacist government bent on making it homogeneous by enforcing racist and apartheid policies is still dicks


white supremacist?

yeah read about how the Israeli govt treats Ethiopian Jews and African asylum-seekers. earlier this year a chief rabbi called black people monkeys. it's an ingrained racist society in similar ways to the U.S.
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Postby mystery meat » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:07 pm

to clarify: junebug's point is good and conscientious leftist anti-zionists absolutely need to make a concerted effort to stray from the kind of rhetoric that is routinely hijacked by hardcore anti-semites where Israel is propped up as conspiratorial string-pulling bogeyman and the source of the world's problems (as opposed to just an authoritarian right-wing state, of which there are and have been many). there are contexts in which 'Israel is still dicks' should ring alarm-bells. i just don't think this hpn thread is one. then again, i would also not be surprised if over the course of the 100pgs in this thread that some iffy shit has been said and there's probably extremely good reason to be vigilant about these things.
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Postby Kenny » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:10 pm

mystery meat wrote:to clarify: junebug's point is good and conscientious leftist anti-zionists absolutely need to make a concerted effort to stray from the kind of rhetoric that is routinely hijacked by hardcore anti-semites where Israel is propped up as conspiratorial string-pulling bogeyman and the source of the world's problems (as opposed to just an authoritarian right-wing state, of which there are and have been many). there are contexts in which 'Israel is still dicks' should ring alarm-bells. i just don't think this hpn thread is one. then again, i would also not be surprised if over the course of the 100pgs in this thread that some iffy shit has been said and there's probably extremely good reason to be vigilant about these things.


Be extremely vigilant but not do a simple easy fix of a thread name
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Postby delgriffith » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:15 pm

Happy to change it to BIBI/LIKUD STILL DICKS or BIBI/LIKUD'S ISRAEL STILL SHIT if keeping Israel in the title would make it easier for people to find

Alternatively I can just title it something more mundane like "Thread for Discussing Israeli Politics"

Thoughts?
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Postby mystery meat » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:18 pm

Kenny wrote:
mystery meat wrote:to clarify: junebug's point is good and conscientious leftist anti-zionists absolutely need to make a concerted effort to stray from the kind of rhetoric that is routinely hijacked by hardcore anti-semites where Israel is propped up as conspiratorial string-pulling bogeyman and the source of the world's problems (as opposed to just an authoritarian right-wing state, of which there are and have been many). there are contexts in which 'Israel is still dicks' should ring alarm-bells. i just don't think this hpn thread is one. then again, i would also not be surprised if over the course of the 100pgs in this thread that some iffy shit has been said and there's probably extremely good reason to be vigilant about these things.


Be extremely vigilant but not do a simple easy fix of a thread name

but Israel is Still Dicks
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Postby def from above » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:24 pm

Change the dang title

Israeli Politics, or even just Israel/Palestine
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Postby big zorb » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:26 pm

BREAKING NEWS: LIKUD STILL DICKS seems like a good compromise
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Postby delgriffith » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:28 pm

Hopefully a thread title solution we can all be happy with.
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Postby mystery meat » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:30 pm

yeah i'm a fan of this
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Postby def from above » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:31 pm

תודה רבה
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Postby Kenny » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:31 pm

Thanks Del <3
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Postby mystery meat » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:35 pm

like i don't think all terse vitriol against an authoritarian right-wing state needs to be tempered or ideologically asterisked to emphatically delineate itself from anti-semitism on a board/community with a more or less shared leftist/left-leaning politics, but it probably should be for a thread title to be read by new users, yeah
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Postby def from above » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:41 pm

you dont think we should separate ourselves from (even unwitting) anti-semitism in all contexts?
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Postby Jimmy Firecracker » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:44 pm

mystery meat wrote:like i don't think all terse vitriol against an authoritarian right-wing state needs to be tempered or ideologically asterisked to emphatically delineate itself from anti-semitism on a board/community with a more or less shared leftist/left-leaning politics, but it probably should be for a thread title to be read by new users, yeah


left-leaning politics and anti semitism arent mutually exclusive
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Postby def from above » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:47 pm

Jimmy Firecracker wrote:left-leaning politics and anti semitism arent mutually exclusive


this
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Postby mortimer » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:48 pm

def from above wrote:תודה רבה

how do you learn to read hebrew without vowels

does this say "todah rabah"?
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Postby def from above » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:49 pm

mortimer wrote:
def from above wrote:תודה רבה

how do you learn to read hebrew without vowels


practice? ask june.

edit: yes, todah rabah
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Postby mortimer » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:50 pm

i haven't practiced any hebrew since i had my bar mitzvah but i just never got that far with my hebrew
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Postby def from above » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:50 pm

i actually took a damn class in college and of course forgot everything
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Postby mystery meat » Wed Oct 10, 2018 1:44 pm

def from above wrote:you dont think we should separate ourselves from (even unwitting) anti-semitism in all contexts?

i mean, there is Israel as the fucked up country and govt that we know it to actually be. and there is Israel as anti-semites falsely present it (global puppetmaster shit) to stoke anti-semitic hatred and conspiracy-mongering and evil (and insofar as leftism can and does overlap with antisemitism, there is a lot of in-between here). the latter characterization should be incinerated. i don't think that all unqualified expressions of anger towards Israel should be assumed the latter until proven the former, and i think there's ways of acknowledging the frightening extent to which anti-semites have shaped discourse about Israel and proactively dissociating from and formulating stratagems for combating it, while also being able to maintain spaces where Israel can be talked about as Bad from the implicit standpoint of anti-racism/human rights/leftism and not have to continuously be asterisking that perspective as 'not anti-semitic' in a way that inadvertently perpetuates anti-semitism as even being a 'side' or a 'position' when it should have zero currency whatsoever in the marketplace of ideas.
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Postby mystery meat » Wed Oct 10, 2018 1:56 pm

like i think it's good and therapeutic that politically likeminded communities can retreat from a dumbass world where racism as an idea still has a seat at the debate club table, and, within that space, regard it implicitly as worthless and evil and therefore shift the spectrum of discourse to a healthier place
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