I guess there should be a thread for the Suspiria remake!

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Postby Ampersand » Sun Nov 04, 2018 6:01 pm

I was overwhelmed with emotion at the end of the final dance scene/spell casting.Toggle Spoiler I had to walk around Best Buy bleary-eyed for awhile after to collect myself.
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Postby Ampersand » Sun Nov 04, 2018 6:02 pm

Also imagine if we’d gotten the David Gordon Green remake of this instead lol
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Postby Dedalus » Sun Nov 04, 2018 6:11 pm

I liked it. For me it did a lot of things right that didn't add up to being better than the original? I wouldn't expect it to but it's hard not to compare. It does seem like a smart template for doing remakes though, focusing on the areas that could use improvement and staying away from the things that it wouldn't be able to top.

I actually liked the 6th act and it felt like it was a good payoff for the more subdued first two hours. The old man character seems like the biggest misstep and the fact that the performance was totally fine is irrelevant and ruined by the gimmick of it. Like they could have cast anyone else and it would have worked way better without changing anything else about it.Toggle Spoiler
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Postby odilon redon » Sun Nov 04, 2018 7:39 pm

its appeal will definitely skew very specific and i feel for those who were held captive by its lack of compassion for the audience but in all it’s excess i loved this thing.

it was like the inland empire of capital “f” Feminine witchy horror. and i strongly suspect it will play even better upon rewatching.

wish this was being received in the same terms that hereditary and the vvitch were, or even the original for that matter because it deserves the accolades and i want more of this
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Postby odilon redon » Sun Nov 04, 2018 7:43 pm

Ampersand wrote:
a is jump wrote:I thought it was great. It felt like Guadagnino had absorbed the Argento version at a molecular level, then rebuilt a totally unique version of the story from his point of view. Despite being wildly different than the original, it still retained the elements that make Suspiria “Suspiria,” which is a pretty amazing feat, since the screenplay seemed to operate from the point of view that whatever choice Argento and Nicolodi made, the opposite choice should be explored.

The original’s German setting is arbitrary? Make it a direct part of the story. Psychologist character exists solely to give a brief exposition dump? Center him as the primary instrument of unraveling the mystery. Not really all that much dance despite the setting? Make the dance an essential element. The school itself teaches ballet, which has strict and codified methods? Now it’s a neo-expressionist style that is driven by emotion and improvisation. The coven is very lightly sketched? Dive deeply into their inner workings.Suzy is a mostly dazed and unaware victim of the coven? Make her Mother Suspiriorum.Toggle Spoiler And on and on.

The net effect of these choices and Guadagnino‘s direction is actually that the fairy tale quality of the original is amplified. The core elements that are at play in both versions begin to feel like some deep seated, ingrained folklore that is being played out as a 2018 art film.

I am a huge fan of the original, and have probably seen it on average once a year for the last 20 years (I know I’ve seen it in the theater at least 5 times). This new version completely exceeded my expectations. In my opinion, it doesn’t really exist to be compared in a qualitative sense to the original, they both are great in their ways.


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Postby Buzz Fledderjohn » Sun Nov 04, 2018 8:58 pm

yeah tilda as the old man was distracting, i would love to hear luca's artistic explanation for it but i'm assuming it's something like "tilda swinton is queen and i thought it'd be fun for her to get to do this part"

going into it i thought there'd be some link towards that character and the other tilda character or that it was the actual character in disguise or something but nope, just kind of pointlessToggle Spoiler

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Postby hyperbole man » Sun Nov 04, 2018 9:04 pm

my bf did not know beforehand that tilda was playing the old guy and did not figure it out during, so i got to blow his mind with that fact afterward

tho his main reaction was "that is so unnecessary!"
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Postby ratbags » Sun Nov 04, 2018 9:06 pm

i'd like luca's artistic explanation of your ass bud!!!
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Postby hyperbole man » Sun Nov 04, 2018 9:07 pm

anyway i keep thinking about this. until i see it again, i don't think i'll get past my overall ~mixed feelings~ reaction, but the parts i liked are lingering much more than the things i disliked. that said, i still think the political/historical window-dressing and the entire dr. josef character arc felt like misfires/dead weight.

love love love the gross olga dance sceneToggle Spoiler and the whole climax.
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Postby a is jump » Mon Nov 05, 2018 10:32 pm

odilon redon wrote:it was like the inland empire of capital “f” Feminine witchy horror. and i strongly suspect it will play even better upon rewatching.


Interesting that you mentioned Inland Empire, because I felt this movie had that power, as well. I saw Inland Empire 7 times in the theater, I was like ADDICTED to that shit, and I could see myself going to Suspiria over and over as well.

I saw it again, and it does play better on a rewatch-- Johnson in particular, her performance is actually nuanced as hell throughout, but you can't pick up on most of it on a first watch because you haven't seen Act 6.

Lots of divisions on display in this-- East and West Germany, Markos and Blanc, Amish and Mennonites... a bunch of split pairs (pears).
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Postby Flossed Out » Mon Nov 05, 2018 10:41 pm

I saw this randomly on Saturday and don't usually do gory movies. Got pretty grossed out during some scenes but by the end I was having a lot of fun. I used to see the cover for Suspiria at the cd store I worked at and at some point during the film I remembered that all of this stuff was supposed to be based on a goofy Italian movie and it made it fun. I don't mean that to sound in any way disrespectful. I found Thom's voice intrusive and had no clue Tilda Swinton played the old man. Wow. I've been singing Suspiria to the tune of Disturbia since I saw it.
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Postby surly » Mon Nov 05, 2018 10:51 pm

The line about how klemperer is responsible for countless women’s misfortunes, including his wife’s, has haunted me since i watched it yesterday

Also his wife is played by jessica harper!
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Postby Daft Pun » Mon Nov 05, 2018 10:55 pm

loved this. my only gripe was thom yorke's voice being allowed in the soundtrack at all, especially during the climaxToggle Spoiler

almost ruined it for me. never saw the original, fwiw, but now i want to check it out.
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Postby Daft Pun » Mon Nov 05, 2018 10:58 pm

surly wrote:The line about how klemperer is responsible for countless women’s misfortunes, including his wife’s, has haunted me since i watched it yesterday

Also his wife is played by jessica harper!
Toggle Spoiler


yeah that whole scene when he was ambushed and they were admonishing him for telling women they were "delusional" was pretty powerful. the chaotic screaming helped tooToggle Spoiler
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Postby black mamba » Tue Nov 06, 2018 12:18 am

Buzz Fledderjohn wrote:yeah tilda as the old man was distracting, i would love to hear luca's artistic explanation for it but i'm assuming it's something like "tilda swinton is queen and i thought it'd be fun for her to get to do this part"

going into it i thought there'd be some link towards that character and the other tilda character or that it was the actual character in disguise or something but nope, just kind of pointlessToggle Spoiler



imo tilda swinton is playing three aspects of the german character and this movie is partly about how a society forgets in order to absolve themselves of guilt. it's about other things but i feel like a major part of it is that it's an allegory for the period after world war 2 and before the modern period in germany. idk if that was a good or bad approach i have to learn more about germany tbhToggle Spoiler
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Postby walt whitman » Tue Nov 06, 2018 1:05 am

Ampersand wrote:
a is jump wrote:I thought it was great. It felt like Guadagnino had absorbed the Argento version at a molecular level, then rebuilt a totally unique version of the story from his point of view. Despite being wildly different than the original, it still retained the elements that make Suspiria “Suspiria,” which is a pretty amazing feat, since the screenplay seemed to operate from the point of view that whatever choice Argento and Nicolodi made, the opposite choice should be explored.

The original’s German setting is arbitrary? Make it a direct part of the story. Psychologist character exists solely to give a brief exposition dump? Center him as the primary instrument of unraveling the mystery. Not really all that much dance despite the setting? Make the dance an essential element. The school itself teaches ballet, which has strict and codified methods? Now it’s a neo-expressionist style that is driven by emotion and improvisation. The coven is very lightly sketched? Dive deeply into their inner workings.Suzy is a mostly dazed and unaware victim of the coven? Make her Mother Suspiriorum.Toggle Spoiler And on and on.

The net effect of these choices and Guadagnino‘s direction is actually that the fairy tale quality of the original is amplified. The core elements that are at play in both versions begin to feel like some deep seated, ingrained folklore that is being played out as a 2018 art film.

I am a huge fan of the original, and have probably seen it on average once a year for the last 20 years (I know I’ve seen it in the theater at least 5 times). This new version completely exceeded my expectations. In my opinion, it doesn’t really exist to be compared in a qualitative sense to the original, they both are great in their ways.


dapped

this is the best take itt.

loved the movie. only complaint from me was the old man's heavy amount of screen time, his whole story seems flimsy. but i appreciate there being a lot of invisible connections and running storylines here, the baader meinhof stuff and broke-ass german setting was just cool as hell.

& those COLORS !! oh 1970s berlin
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Postby Viola Swamp » Tue Nov 06, 2018 1:39 am

had the privilege of watching this last tuesday and a second time tonight with a theater screening of the original in-between

they succeed in such different and bold ways, and I'd characterize the original as very un-pretentious and this one as uber-pretentious, and the runtime seemed luxurious the first time but flew by on re-watch

into the dapped post and also the "three aspects of the german character" idea

still unpacking all the "meaning"/allegory, but i really loved it. my wife is a witch so she's more invested in figuring out what it's saying about witches (not sure that's gonna turn out well)

i'm pitching this to my friends as "if Punchdrunk theater company did a Fassbinder show"
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Postby surly » Tue Nov 06, 2018 1:55 am

there's probably some element of tilda playing the ego (blanc), superego (klemperer) and id (markos) in a tale where susie self actualizes and provides the proper balance of those three elements or some such. each character has their own sins--klemperer's passivity/refusal to hear women, markos' pretention at being the mother and using the rituals to sustain her life, and blanc engaging in some sacrifice ostensibly for the good of the rest of the coven--and each is punished for their transgressionsToggle Spoiler

i dunno, i need to watch it again (and probably a third time)
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Postby davideotape » Tue Nov 06, 2018 2:27 am

I vacillate between i *like* that there wasnt a Shyamylan reveal with Swintons old guy casting, but i didnt like that i was waiting to be annoyed by it the first time i watched it because it took me away from being in the moment...

then i try to figure out why it happened at all and i think if its just because they didnt want any cis het men in primary roles ok but is that kinda hacky? I imagine that alone wouldn't be it, so maybe it was to call out more the relationship between the two characters she played and how the world treats them both based on gender alone, him being relieved of the shame of his sins vs. her head chopped almost off (Not my insight there, except the dynamic of the casting)

Then i read an article where the filmmakers were just like “yeah we just didnt want any dudes” and ok?
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Postby mellowgold » Tue Nov 06, 2018 10:03 am

ok i keep having dreams about this movie help
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Postby Viola Swamp » Tue Nov 06, 2018 11:35 am

I heard the secret reasoning behind Swinton stunt casting was that all the 80-year-old men they had playing the role kept dying under mysterious circumstances
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Postby walt whitman » Tue Nov 06, 2018 1:30 pm

the long run time wasnt a problem for me esp, with all the psychedelic ana mendieta blood dreams, dread n suspense, & with the clearly marked chapter breaks (which is something longer movies should get in the habit of doing prob)
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Postby carlagain » Wed Nov 07, 2018 2:21 am

yes yes yes yes so sick

that climax was some radical empathy sion sono the OA shit. Thom is singing out the hole in her chest right?Toggle Spoiler
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Postby carlagain » Wed Nov 07, 2018 2:24 am

DIGITAL BLOODToggle Spoiler
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Postby carlagain » Wed Nov 07, 2018 2:26 am

I’m flying
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Postby manvstrees » Wed Nov 07, 2018 2:28 am

look, montage of 'who voted markos' and exploding heads completely counteracts that twee stuffToggle Spoiler
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Postby carlagain » Wed Nov 07, 2018 2:31 am

the director seems kind of dumb and does that thing where you like allude to meaning even though you didn’t have to but it’s absence is disappointing. but this also seems like the perfect movie for him, but I haven’t seen the other. great use of Swinton. cross cutting may have ruined cinema but that first death was extremely effective and the thing where the witches stare into space evidently seeing the other scene is great. I’m going to take dance classes
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Postby carlagain » Wed Nov 07, 2018 2:33 am

if you’re talking to me “twee” doesn’t mean anything to me, in this context at least
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Postby Buzz Fledderjohn » Wed Nov 07, 2018 3:01 am

wait can someone clarify what was going on with the detective and the dick+scythe? did i miss something or did it cut from them like torturing and harassing that dude to him casually back talking with the other cop the next day?Toggle Spoiler
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Postby carlagain » Wed Nov 07, 2018 3:06 am

the dudes were bewitched and they didn’t actually cut him, the cops evidently came out of it not remembering that bit. that scene was fucking tight like many of the scenesToggle Spoiler
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