the last of us 2 spoilers thread

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Postby someguy » Sat Jun 27, 2020 1:36 pm

Played the game. It's very good! I'd say one of the best stories I've seen in a game but this is a very low bar to clear since I don't play a lot of video games. Random thoughts:

-I kept hearing the game was about Ellie taking vengeance after some incident, which I thought was going to be a faction invading Jackson and laying waste to everyone in the town. I don't know why I was so convinced of this, I thought after Ellie's Day 3 that she'd come back to the town in ruins. I wish they did a little more with the Jackson location though, but I get it has its function as a utopia

-I didn't read the leaks but I didn't realize the angry reactions were just over Joel's death. I thought that it was obvious he was going to die (or at the very least be sidelined) based on the marketing and common sense. The dude is old and his story didn't have anywhere to go after the first game

-Hillcrest in Day 2 is one of the highlights in the earlier sections of the game, just really tense and overwhelming and the finale in the car with Jesse is great

-The whole structural gambit with replaying as Abby makes sense and works on a thematic level but it's a bit of a slog to get through. The earlier sections are largely walk and talk (works fine at the opening of the game in Jackson but doing it over again halfway through got me impatient), the level structure of several detours between points A and B gets taxing, and her storyline shows how undercooked the whole Seraphite/WLF elements are. I had no investment in that aspect, just a bunch of contrivances to get the main story where it needed

-That being said, what makes up for it is Abby's gameplay being way more varied/fun than Ellie's. Loved the whole section on Day 2 of Abby and Lev going from the rapids to up in the sky and down through the hotel. The climax with the burning island is also pretty impressive, I wish there was more of the section where you stealth through the WLF/Seraphite shootouts and take out both sides

-The hospital basement section of Abby's story is just Resident Evil, and as well done as it is I hate playing RE so I hated playing through it. Had to stop playing the first time I encountered the rat king and try again the next day

-Surprised at how lengthy the epilogue was with Santa Barbara. A bit of a slog to play through because I had my fill of taking out armed soldiers by that point, but I guess that is the point

-There will probably be a part 3, and the easiest bet would be some sort of redemptive arc. TLOU1 felt like it could have existed on its own, but this has so many new characters and elements established I can't see them walking away from it
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Postby Seamus » Sat Jun 27, 2020 2:16 pm

At 33 hours don't read this if you aren't finished probably cause major spoilers but holy shit the bit in the hotel where it goes full horror and you get the flamethrower, and then the hospital with that huge thing in the basement, followed by the Tommy sniper chaseToggle Spoiler was all awesome. sky bridgesToggle Spoiler were dumb tho
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Postby auspice » Sat Jun 27, 2020 2:30 pm

someguy wrote:Played the game. It's very good! I'd say one of the best stories I've seen in a game but this is a very low bar to clear since I don't play a lot of video games. Random thoughts:

-I kept hearing the game was about Ellie taking vengeance after some incident, which I thought was going to be a faction invading Jackson and laying waste to everyone in the town. I don't know why I was so convinced of this, I thought after Ellie's Day 3 that she'd come back to the town in ruins. I wish they did a little more with the Jackson location though, but I get it has its function as a utopia

-I didn't read the leaks but I didn't realize the angry reactions were just over Joel's death. I thought that it was obvious he was going to die (or at the very least be sidelined) based on the marketing and common sense. The dude is old and his story didn't have anywhere to go after the first game

-Hillcrest in Day 2 is one of the highlights in the earlier sections of the game, just really tense and overwhelming and the finale in the car with Jesse is great

-The whole structural gambit with replaying as Abby makes sense and works on a thematic level but it's a bit of a slog to get through. The earlier sections are largely walk and talk (works fine at the opening of the game in Jackson but doing it over again halfway through got me impatient), the level structure of several detours between points A and B gets taxing, and her storyline shows how undercooked the whole Seraphite/WLF elements are. I had no investment in that aspect, just a bunch of contrivances to get the main story where it needed

-That being said, what makes up for it is Abby's gameplay being way more varied/fun than Ellie's. Loved the whole section on Day 2 of Abby and Lev going from the rapids to up in the sky and down through the hotel. The climax with the burning island is also pretty impressive, I wish there was more of the section where you stealth through the WLF/Seraphite shootouts and take out both sides

-The hospital basement section of Abby's story is just Resident Evil, and as well done as it is I hate playing RE so I hated playing through it. Had to stop playing the first time I encountered the rat king and try again the next day

-Surprised at how lengthy the epilogue was with Santa Barbara. A bit of a slog to play through because I had my fill of taking out armed soldiers by that point, but I guess that is the point

-There will probably be a part 3, and the easiest bet would be some sort of redemptive arc. TLOU1 felt like it could have existed on its own, but this has so many new characters and elements established I can't see them walking away from it
Toggle Spoiler


I agree with you about Joel's deathToggle Spoiler being something I expected, their first plot details about the game were that it would be a tale of Ellie getting vengeance for losing someone close to her, could not have been more obvious what they were planning. amusing that a large chunk of the fanbase would apparently rather play as older JoelToggle Spoiler instead of a young limber Ellie because they don't view playing as Ellie a "realistic" option, that's gamers for you these days.

As for what ND does next I'd honestly rather see new IP for them before TLOU 3, especially since TLOU 2 is basically two games in one. Would be cool to see a space game with ND mechanics. Otherwise I'd think I'd rather see new Uncharted if they're not gonna make new IP.
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Postby chairkicker » Sat Jun 27, 2020 2:42 pm

i didn't expect joel's death if only because i thought it would be more interesting to keep him alive (only as an NPC) and ellie in the dark (even if he she had obvious suspicions) and play them against each other in her quest for vengeance. so yeah i fully expected some attack on jackson that left joel alive. once i first got control of abby i knew he was a dead man, though, which of course was the point. i'm not unhappy they went in that direction but i wonder if keeping him alive might have given them more interesting ends to explore the cycle of violence. i fucking love his last interaction with ellie, thoughToggle Spoiler
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Postby figaro2 » Sat Jun 27, 2020 2:47 pm

dang this is a 30 hour game?

posted in the VG thread that I've like been slowly going through Uncharted 4 and am under/around 15 hours play time it still seems probably a few hours too long mainly because of the combat scenarios getting a bit tedious (which is my gripe with all naughty dog games really!) would be interested if this one sort of alleviates those issues by mixing up/introducing new scenarios throughout the game to make them a bit funner to play over the course of such a lengthy game.

still really want to play this but I think by the time I have money again I can hold out for the PS5 version or something.
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Postby chairkicker » Sat Jun 27, 2020 2:59 pm

it earns its runtime, i think. combat never once felt tedious. i put 35 hours in but i really took my time
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Postby walt whitman » Sat Jun 27, 2020 4:28 pm

how does one dislike resident evil but like last of us

:ponder:
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Postby chairkicker » Sat Jun 27, 2020 4:30 pm

someguy doesn't like horror if i remember right
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Postby kirito » Sat Jun 27, 2020 5:05 pm

auspice wrote:still on Seattle Day 2, going through the Seraphites level. the workbench attackToggle Spoiler scared the fucking shit out of me

same though why didn't they just shoot her...Toggle Spoiler
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Postby kirito » Sat Jun 27, 2020 5:06 pm

walt whitman wrote:how does one dislike resident evil but like last of us

:ponder:

yeah unfortunately a lot of the infected encounters just make me wish i was playing re2 remake instead
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Postby auspice » Sat Jun 27, 2020 5:18 pm

kirito wrote:
auspice wrote:still on Seattle Day 2, going through the Seraphites level. the workbench attackToggle Spoiler scared the fucking shit out of me

same though why didn't they just shoot her...Toggle Spoiler


I love how one of the guys does a battle yell first. I had just repaired my melee weapon so I immediately sliced through them all, was pretty satisfying.

The funniest part of it was just before using the bench I was getting really annoyed at the locked door and how there didn't appear to be any solution for it and wad dreading having to go online and consult a walkthrough, lol
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Postby someguy » Sat Jun 27, 2020 5:32 pm

chairkicker wrote:someguy doesn't like horror if i remember right


no this is wrong

I'm just not a fan of the RE series, for some reason its take on survival horror has never done it for me. I like lots of horror games. That particular section I mentioned was really stressful and reminded me of when I tried the RE2 remake, which I hated and didn't finishToggle Spoiler
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Postby kirito » Sat Jun 27, 2020 8:17 pm

the hammer kill where you impale their face with the claw... hoo boy
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Postby jalapeño ranch » Sat Jun 27, 2020 8:32 pm

I’ve put the game on pause for two days now because climbing into the infected area after the bridge has been stressing me out too much and I know it gets way more stressful. Was gonna play some today but need to relax.
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Postby Robo-Chachi » Sat Jun 27, 2020 8:40 pm

I had an encounter with the WLF earlier tonight where I decided to rush a guy. I figured he would get a shot off first but right as I came out of hiding he glanced to the left just long enough for me to close the distance and hit him with an axe.

Have a bunch of little split-second encounters like that that stick with me for how well the game executes them.
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Postby chairkicker » Sat Jun 27, 2020 9:27 pm

someguy wrote:
chairkicker wrote:someguy doesn't like horror if i remember right


no this is wrong

I'm just not a fan of the RE series, for some reason its take on survival horror has never done it for me. I like lots of horror games. That particular section I mentioned was really stressful and reminded me of when I tried the RE2 remake, which I hated and didn't finishToggle Spoiler

my memory sucks lately
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Postby Seamus » Sun Jun 28, 2020 11:40 am

Last 5 hours of this game suck and are completely unnecessary.

I really wanted them to just have Abby kill Ellie in the theatre and then let Dina go or whatever and end it there.Toggle Spoiler

It took a couple of hours to get into but overall I enjoyed the Abby section way more than the Ellie section. Ellie sucks!Toggle Spoiler
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Postby walt whitman » Sun Jun 28, 2020 12:41 pm

^ disagree about last five hours being unnecessary. the final confrontation is... stunning. pure emotional catharsis

the abby section was stronger, i agree. her perspective really enhances the world building and narrative possibilities of TLOU franchise
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Postby kirito » Sun Jun 28, 2020 1:15 pm

just switched to abby's flashback.Toggle Spoiler why am i supposed to sympathize with or feel bad for the wlf? i understand they've probably changed because of their war with the seraphites but they still shoot trespassers on sight, train dogs to maul people and condoned a revenge assassination mission against a guy who had never wronged them. it is rad that they live in an nfl stadium though
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Postby kirito » Sun Jun 28, 2020 1:23 pm

this dude manny spit on joel's corpse and wanted to kill ellie immediately after for no reason and i'm supposed to feel bad because he has a sick dad?Toggle Spoiler
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Postby chairkicker » Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:29 pm

last five hours has one of the most creative encounters in the game. i can't imagine not having some fun with it.
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Postby Seamus » Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:32 pm

chairkicker wrote:last five hours has one of the most creative encounters in the game. i can't imagine not having some fun with it.


Which one? the chained infected?Toggle Spoiler
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Postby auspice » Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:45 pm

kirito wrote:just switched to abby's flashback.Toggle Spoiler why am i supposed to sympathize with or feel bad for the wlf? i understand they've probably changed because of their war with the seraphites but they still shoot trespassers on sight, train dogs to maul people and condoned a revenge assassination mission against a guy who had never wronged them. it is rad that they live in an nfl stadium though


I mean, it isn't technically true that Joel never wronged them - he did kill Abby's fatherToggle Spoiler.

I started the AbbyToggle Spoiler section last night as well, didn't play it for very long but I already love the gameplay itself and different environments, seems like this section is more set-piece heavy

I do agree though about the WLF not matching up tonally with their depiction in Ellie's section. it's pretty jarring especially given how brutally Abby killed Joel, although I guess the scene where you're forced to kill Nora as Ellie is supposed to be a direct comparison to that since Ellie's facial expression is animated to look like Abby's during that moment. It's also weird how chill Abby is after getting back from the trip to murder her father's killer. Plus it's bizarre how when Abby finds Ellie at the theater and kills Jesse, she goes off on Ellie saying "I don't get it, we let the rest of you live!" as if Ellie was supposed to have any idea who she was or what the context of Joel's revenge murder was.

I'm all for the creative decision to do two games in one and am looking forward to the rest of this section's gameplay but I think this narrative twist is easily the weakest aspect of Neil's writing. I'm definitely curious what the plotline of TLOU2 will look like in the HBO show though, hopefully Craig Mazin will be able to get it to make more sense
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Postby kirito » Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:55 pm

kirito wrote:can i just ask what the hell is abby eating in the apocalypse to be this fucking huge

i actually really like how this was addressed.
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Postby auspice » Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:56 pm

kirito wrote:
kirito wrote:can i just ask what the hell is abby eating in the apocalypse to be this fucking huge

i actually really like how this was addressed.


It was? I was hoping there'd be a flashback with the sole purpose of showing how Abby gets rippedToggle Spoiler
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Postby kirito » Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:58 pm

auspice wrote:Plus it's bizarre how when Abby finds Ellie at the theater and kills Jesse, she goes off on Ellie saying "I don't get it, we let the rest of you live!" as if Ellie was supposed to have any idea who she was or what the context of Joel's revenge murder was.Toggle Spoiler.

this bothered me so much. she did the exact same fucking thing you did only you were lucky enough to catch joel without having to kill hundreds of jackson residents between you and him, which you were READY TO DO before you found him. only i deserve my revenge!!!Toggle Spoiler
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Postby kirito » Sun Jun 28, 2020 3:04 pm

auspice wrote:
kirito wrote:
kirito wrote:can i just ask what the hell is abby eating in the apocalypse to be this fucking huge

i actually really like how this was addressed.


It was? I was hoping there'd be a flashback with the sole purpose of showing how Abby gets rippedToggle Spoiler

you walk past a gigantic weight room and through the cafeteria which is obviously well supplied, abby scarfs down a burrito and walks in her room and it's revealed it's a suite inside a football stadium and they've turned the field and stands into farming space. pretty effectively dismissed my qualms about it.Toggle Spoiler
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Postby auspice » Sun Jun 28, 2020 4:10 pm

if they do another TLOU I really think they should just do away with Ellie and do a story about factions developing in one of America's cities, preferably one with really diverse / mountainous terrain to give the gameplay more variety. like story and gameplay wise it would be way more interesting to a play a game that's all about several different factions going to war with each other.
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Postby chairkicker » Sun Jun 28, 2020 4:18 pm

Seamus wrote:
chairkicker wrote:last five hours has one of the most creative encounters in the game. i can't imagine not having some fun with it.


Which one? the chained infected?Toggle Spoiler

yeah, of course. but then i loved all the encounters in that area
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Postby kirito » Sun Jun 28, 2020 4:35 pm

auspice wrote:if they do another TLOU I really think they should just do away with Ellie and do a story about factions developing in one of America's cities, preferably one with really diverse / mountainous terrain to give the gameplay more variety. like story and gameplay wise it would be way more interesting to a play a game that's all about several different factions going to war with each other.

pretty disappointing that the other main faction in this game is just an evil death cult. murder is bad but please enjoy this unambiguously horrific human faction to slaughter!
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